The subject line of this email was written by a young marketer who had little faith in me …so of course I had to prove him wrong. 🙂
I not only read his email, but I wrote him a detailed response.
And since I spent significant time composing the response—he hit a nerve (as you will see below) –I want to repurpose it here as this week’s post for everyone in my online family.
There are some lessons I learned about myself while responding…and the student of marketing who “got me” with his subject line learned something too.
At least that is what he told me. 🙂
Here is his email:
If it’s the 30% chance that you read this, I hope you’ll answer me.
You’re a legend, over 4 decades, practicing direct marketing.
[NOTE: He not only teased me with his subject line but called me a legend. How could I not respond to him?]
Your post titled, “It’s not about the price…until it is” (regarding how to price a mastermind) made me wonder:
“When was the first time you did something JUST for the money? And when was the last?”
I hope you don’t think I’m arrogant.
I’m naive because I don’t have the experience.
I’ve seen people on Twitter and LinkedIn say:
“I’m not here for money, I’m here to help people.”
And I roll my eyes every single time.
I’m in this for the money.
I want to prove to my parents that I’m not dilly dallying.
I want to shove it in their face that I am serious about this, and money is the proof that I can make this work.
I want to know your story.
What was the moment you were no longer in it for the money?
Was it a dream client?
A dream revenue?
Any personal moment of realization?
Something else?
When you say you’re not in it for the money, I believe you.
You’ve seen so many things, people, success, maybe a few failures, and everything in between.
So, you’re after the joy of helping people.
But I need to know how you got there.
I am asking you this question because I like to help people too.
But I don’t know at what point I’ll ever be able to not prioritize money and get to a place where it’s all about the impact I can make.
My response:
First and foremost, you are anything but arrogant.
And you have a right to be “suspicious” since I also often hear folks claiming, “I’m in it for impact (i.e. “helping people”) over money.”
We are always in it for the money…but money isn’t what buys you contentment.
Money buys you freedom.
And freedom is everything.
When I talk about “doing it for the money…or not” I understand I am at a different stage in my career (i.e. I no longer need to worry about “paying the rent”) …so your question makes perfect sense.
But it’s a lot more than being 67 years old with close to 45 years of cumulative experience.
“Time served” (and still “serving”) is only part of the story.
You got me thinking…about a time when I was living paycheck to paycheck…when food and shelter were of paramount importance (well, they are always important) …but you know what I mean.
I realized that my mindset was always one of abundance as opposed to scarcity.
That is, if I’m not making money today, I can always make money in the future…and I will never starve.
More on that in a minute.
Hopefully with the benefit of my experience I can alleviate some of your “naivete”…but I wouldn’t call it that either.
I would say it’s closer to healthy skepticism on your part. 🙂
When I say I am not in it for the money, I often follow that up with, “I am not a non-profit either.”
However, making money to “prove it to someone else” is not a prescription for long-term success…in my experience.
I would recommend that over time, you get that out of your thinking.
But only if it serves you.
It served me.
One of the quotes I live by:
“Everything in business (and life) is not a revenue event; but everything IS a relationship event.”
It didn’t happen in a “moment”…but rather a series of moments…but it started with that abundance mindset that money is always about the past and your relationship capital, your accumulated wisdom, your resources, your contacts (driven by your contributions) are the assets that follow you for your entire life.
Some of those “moments”:
- Early in my career, a world class copywriter I worked with became an entrepreneur and launched his own company…and stopped writing to focus on running his company. When he passed on a writing assignment from me, I ignorantly told him he was wasting one of his core talents (copywriting). He confidently replied: “No one can ever take my copywriting skill away from me.” And he followed that up with the line I adapted for my myself: “I’ll never starve.”
- When I was contemplating leaving my beloved Boardroom Inc. after 34 years (leaving a lot of money on the table), Dan Sullivan (the top coach for entrepreneurs in the world) gave me the “money and material things are about the past” framework…and it was much more than just words. It is the way I live my life every day. Another way to express the same thing: “You don’t need a luggage rack on a hearse.” 🙂
- After I left Boardroom, an entrepreneur I respect said to me: “You have nothing to prove.” Those five words were so freeing…and why I suggested you get off proving something to someone else as your motivation to make money (in your case your parents). I believe if I had shed the notion of proving something to someone else sooner, I would have embraced the full monty of the abundance mindset a decade earlier than I did. But I got there…which is all that matters.
- Over 20 years ago, I learned about “The 5 ways we get paid…and fifth is cash”…from Dan Sullivan and Joe Polish…which was pivotal for me. You can read the details about this here. The thesis: There are many ways to become rich.
Doing everything—or nothing—for money alone did not originate from a dream client. a dream revenue event or I that I woke from a dream one day with a single epiphany.
It took a while to get to this state.
However, it wasn’t just about getting older, becoming wiser and accumulating money over time to get here.
It started with a giving, abundant mindset.
Which I had before all of those “moments” throughout my career.
It inspired my book, Overdeliver, which has as its subtitle:
“Build a Business for a Lifetime Playing the Long Game in Direct Response Marketing.”
The long game contained all those moments above and many more…but there was a foundation of giving embedded in my DNA.
More about that in the P.S.
I hope this is helpful to you.
It was to me since you made me think more deeply about this critical area.
And you inspired a blog post in the process. 🙂
Warmly,
Brian
P.S. One of the quotes from the young marketer’s email above that was especially jarring for me:
I’ve seen people on Twitter and LinkedIn say:
“I’m not here for money, I’m here to help people.”
And I roll my eyes every single time.
It was jarring because I pictured you…and everyone I communicate with regularly…rolling their eyes whenever I share my mission (i.e. talking about how I help everyone inside my Titans Xcelerator Mastermind become better marketers and copywriters, irrespective of what they pay me).
So today…rather than me telling you how I work and play in direct response marketing…for personal satisfaction and endorphin rushes as much as money… I will have two long time members of the mastermind show how my mission of impact (helping) first has positively affected them and their businesses.
These are two examples of hundreds of endorphin rushes I’ve received over the years…and there’s nothing better. 🙂
From Vance Morris, one of the top “experience marketers” (i.e. he creates experiences first…and then worries about the products and funnels) …and he is the world’s best at it:
Brian has put together a brilliant and eclectic group of entrepreneurs, who are willing to help each other.
There’s really nothing else like it.
As for Brian?
Well, for starters, he helped me in refining my audience and offer.
He brings some of the best marketing minds in the world to talk to the group.
And he can introduce you to a bevy of people.
Brian is a what-you-see-is-what-you-get kinda guy.
If you are looking for fellowship, feedback, ideas and the odd chuckle, Titans Xcelerator is THE place to be.
I’m a founding member and have no plans on quitting anytime soon.
From Jack Turk, a wonderful and “fast” copywriter (how’s that for an oxymoron?) …who teaches his methodology…and brings together the best-of-the-best to teach theirs:
Back in 2015, when I informed management at GKIC that I’d be leaving the company and my role as Head Copywriter, I managed to wrangle a 30-minute chat with Dan Kennedy during that year’s SuperConference.
(And gratis BTW, which was special since Dan guards his time savagely.)
I asked his advice as to how best to leverage my experience with GKIC and “Planet Dan” in moving out to the freelance world as a copywriter.
The first words out of his mouth:
“Get to know Brian Kurtz.”
So, I made the connection and have been part of Brian’s world ever since.
Besides being extremely savvy in the ways of marketing, business, and connecting like-minded souls together, the one key takeaway I’ve gotten from Brian has been simple:
“Always overdeliver.”
Yeah, that was an easy reference, since he wrote a book on the topic with that title.
But it’s more than a book title to Brian.
He has shown up in my life and career and provided so much overwhelming value over and again in so many ways.
He’s helped me with career decisions, making introductions with other potential partners, contributing his time / wisdom for my very successful “Copywriting Summit” …and he’s always there for me to provide counsel and advice.
And I’ve watched him do likewise many times with many others.
Titans Xcelerator is an amazing group, with everyone dedicated to lifting each other up and encouraging one another to achieve whatever greatness lies within them.
And frankly, members with attitudes to the contrary (i.e. being “takers” and not “givers”) don’t linger long.
Which is just fine.
As Ben Franklin said, “We all either hang together or we will hang separately.”
The fact that Titans hang together, and have done so for six years to date, is testament to Brian’s leadership, wisdom, and heart.
NOTE: Titans Xcelerator is not free.
But it is reasonably priced.
Actually, it’s intentionally underpriced.
To attract more people who I–and the group–can impact and help.
Oops…there I go again…talking about impact and helping over money. 🙂
Let me try it this way:
“Come for the information and stay for inspiration” …like Vance and Jack have…and 250 others like them.
Inspiration in the form of actionable impact and help you will receive…while sharing your own impact by helping others.
I also guarantee you will receive emotional impact from multiple endorphin rushes on a regular basis if you start from a place of abundance, contribution and giving.
Does any of this sound enticing?
Transformative?
Fun?
Hopefully you are at least a little curious…and maybe there is a 30% to 70% chance you want to read more about it? 🙂
Check it out here.